at the top of the show we asked why are you awake? why? john tower has some of your answers. >> we have with a terrible flu. still have the energy to argue with joe, i know he can't hear me, but it takes the pain away. >> you can get like a really high temperature and burn it off. just listen. >> i've got heart felt responses. i've been watching the show at 2:30 a.m. since going on maternity leave two months ago, i can't wait until my baby sleeps better and i can stop watching. >> i love it. >> and in new jersey, jet lagged from a trip to india. so you have me as your viewer for another week until i get out of jet lag. >> we'll take you a week. "morning joe" starts right now.

♪ nation, i love new york city. the big apple, the city that never sleeps, rat zanadu. so i was crushed to learn the metropolis i know and love has changed. >> not one person was murdered in new york city on monday. nypd deputy commissioner paul brown couldn't even remember the last time a day went by where not one person was shot, stabbed, or slashed. >> what happened? i remember the real new york of the '80s. when in a single night you could score some weed, catch a time square porno and get stabbed in the neck by a coked up lou reid. and that was a pretty good first

date. now time square has become a bubba gump wimp company. good morning. it's tuesday. december 4th. welcome to "morning joe." with us onset, we have msnbc senior political analyst mark haleprin. oh, my god, please stop. just get it off. get it off -- >> pulitzer prize-winning historian jon meacham. "the art of power." >> so you know why i'm doing this. last night, mika goes to madison square garden thinking she's going to see one direction and teenage girls screaming and all that. >> yeah. >> instead, her car gets sidetracked, she winds up at the 92nd street "y," and there are a bunch of screaming girls at the "y."

jon meacham's new number one selling book. >> i tried to hand your book out last night at the concert. they weren't interested. >> well, they've probably already got it. >> i've never been to a pop concert. >> did it change your life? >> i have never witnessed such an epic meltdown on the part of thousands and thousands of teenage girls. >> metdown. screaming -- >> screaming. >> other than the group that was at the 92nd street "y" last night that screamed at jon meacham. he was throwing wigs at them. >> jefferson versus one direction is like oasis versus blur. >> and mika, of course, is on the blur side of this. >> i tried to do a report like some of yours. i talk to the camera. you can't hear me. >> did you get one? >> of this girl melting down behind me. >> is this like beatle mania. >> this girl is screaming and falls to the ground. >> oh, there was so much

fainting. >> the morning they were on the "today" show. >> you can't see this, can you? okay. the girl behind me i'm pointing at her. she goes down to the ground at some point, starts to cry, but i'm trying to talk, you can't hear me, they're screaming so loud. >> you are reporting. >> there she goes -- and she seriously -- i think i scared her, actually. >> you scared all the girls there. >> were you on the floor. >> listen to them. it's amazing. >> you were a hero to your girls, weren't you? >> listen to them. oh, there she goes down. she just flops on the ground. >> is down! >> are you okay? i don't know. shell might have needed to go to the hospital. >> jon meacham, congratulations on your book. you're number one, my man. >> thank you, thank you. i appreciate it. >> i taught him how to say number one in japanese last night. >> really. >> ichiban. >> i think there's a trick, i'm not going to say it. >> you are in our hearts.

you can tell us what's going on in washington. what's going on in washington? >> bad dynamics. >> really? >> those of us optimistic there'd be a deal. the white house has blasted boehner's offer as much as the republicans blasted the president's. people like to say, oh, they're going to posture, but behind the scenes they're working it out. they're not. >> i hear chuck todd reported yesterday behind the scenes a top aide to barack obama, willie geist. and this -- i don't -- i'm not really good at reading the tea leaves. maybe this is good, maybe this is bad. but a top obama aide yesterday told chuck todd that if the republicans -- if these republicans were in power when abraham lincoln were there, there would still be slavery. does that help the process move along? or does it hurt? i don't really know -- >> reading between the lines. >> i know one direction, i know boy bands. >> reading between the lines, that's probably a bad omen. we do have four weeks, though. >> that's bad. >> absolutely. we have, i believe, we have 27

negotiating days. until the year end. >> there is a rule in life. >> what is that rule? >> i think that slavery analogies and hitler jokes never work out well. >> you don't do that. >> never end well. >> usually they have a bad, you know -- >> but if you're a reporter covering this story now, you don't need to sort of badger people at the white house or on the hill for negative stuff on the other side. they're reaching out to blast, and, again, maybe it'll all settle out in the end, but -- >> who's they? >> people at the white house and republicans on the hill. they're looking for opportunities to blast the other side. >> the white house offer, the first offer was in bad faith, it was pathetic. >> the first offer. >> the republicans' counter offer was, i think, in bad faith and pathetic. >> and they released it to the press, i believe, before they released it to the white house. >> that doesn't matter. i mean, these are two really pathetic -- >> it's part of a game. >> this is not exactly the first rodeo in the past 18 months on

all of these issues. so there's -- everybody knows what everybody was willing to do 20 minutes ago, and so to revert just doesn't make any sense. >> you're the historian, jon, really quickly. and people may see this as being ideological on my part, it's not on my part. 100 years from now, no one's going to remember john boehner's name, no one's going to remember harry reid's name, no one's going to believe 20 seconds from now that john boehner and harry reid were the architects of any deal or any failure. when does the president realize that he is sitting in the chair of thomas jefferson, of abraham lincoln, of woodrow wilson, t.r., fdr, jfk, ronald reagan. when does he realize that and step up and start doing what abraham lincoln did? >> yeah. >> and buy them off, charm them

off, beat them up. >> build a bridge to nowhere. >> build a bridge. when is he going to do that? >> you know, what puzzles me about this is that he knows all that lincoln history. he didn't need to go to the movie to learn that's how lincoln operated. >> and he loved to cast himself as a new lincoln. but his inability to work with democrats and republicans -- listen friends at home watching, not just republicans, democrats and republicans, you have to go back to jimmy carter to find a president that was viewed with as much suspicion by his own party on the hill. >> his own party. >> -- as barack obama. >> i heard a new story the other day. lamar alexander, the former governor and senator from tennessee. just describing a scene, you know, howard baker was everett dirkson's son-in-law. and during the run up to the civil rights bill, howard is sitting up in dirkson's office,

phone rings, dirkson picks it up, says -- and all howard can say is him saying, mr. president, i just can't come down tonight, i was there last night. i was there the night before, i just got to go home. hangs up. 20 minutes passed, and he hears beagles barking in the hallway outside his office. and lbj walks in with his dogs. so because he wouldn't come down to see him, johnson called a car, got in and came up to just force a conversation with dirkson. >> and lyndon johnson -- >> and we got a bill. >> and by the way, l lyndon johnson. he's so detached and disconnected from the hill, he would call, mark haleprin, famously, subcommittee chairman in the house. and say, hey, i hear the mark-up didn't go very well today. do you need any help? what can i do? do you need me to call anybody?

how can i push this along? again, we're not heaping all the blame on the president. let me underline again. >> yeah. >> john boehner's counter offer was pathetic. even the tea party groups are saying the counter offer was pathetic. this republican party in the house better show courage or it's going to be voted out of power two years from now. i want to see, at least, if you're not going to offer new revenue, you better offer a lot of cuts and they're doing neither. so you've got to blame both sides, but there's only one president. >> the president's going to have to do something big, i think, to get this done. he's not -- he's more power and sway than a lot of people including i thought he would have coming out of the election. issues like entitlement reform and new revenue, but he's going to have to do something big. there's been a four-year course of he doesn't get along with either party, doesn't make the kind of effort you're talking about. i don't think there's any doubt he's going to, particularly john

boehner, find some human interconnection moment that says we're doing this. and that's when the tough part starts. because once there's a leader deal, getting it through the house, whatever the terms of it is going to be super hard. >> i was with a group of businessmen last night, and their question was, why don't the people in washington do what we do when there's an important decision that comes up? why don't they get into a room and hammer it out, get some food, drinks, whether it's a couple days, get them helicopters, and go to camp david. you get in a room together -- >> the president -- the president doesn't like doing that. he's not comfortable doing that. and jon meacham, that is not the opinion of a pundit, that is a matter of historical record for his first four years. is it not? >> that's totally true. and the last time that really happened, turned out very, very well for the country and very, very poorly for the president. which was the summer of 1990 at

andrews air force base where george h.w. bush went in there. we forget now how incredibly overwhelming the deficit story was at that point. you know, you look at that administration. the coming in, just no one thought they could do anything. it's not unlike the conversations we're having now. and they went in, they did the deal, president bush had to shift from read my lips to as only he could put it, read my hips. and it was good for the country, it created a political dynamic that cost president bush the election in 1992, and which we're still living, because that gave us grover norquist, et cetera. >> let's get to grover norquist in a minute, but i do have a question. the gop plan consists of $2.2 trillion in savings over a decade. that includes raging the eligibility age for medicare from 65 to 67. and lowering cost of living increases for social security benefits. they also propose overhauling

the tax code to generate $800 billion in new revenue. but without raising taxes on the wealthy. in a letter to the president, leading republicans compared their plan to one erskine bowles drew up last year. >> not even close. >> he rejected that connection and the white house, of course, is hitting the road. we'll get to that in a moment. but here's my question. i've been watching the coverage of this and reading it. and there's a lot of liberals who were like, he won, ha, ha, they're so arrogant about it, it's hard to like them. because it's just not attractive. but he did -- >> yeah, he won. >> and he is going to the american people with this. and why can't the starting point of these negotiations be about the tax rates and go from there. why are we at square one? and why is this on the president at this point? since he won. i understand the first four

years being kind of bruising. >> right. >> but -- at what point does he have the right to draw a line in the sand? >> so he has every right to draw a line in the sand because he won. >> right. >> he has a mandate. >> right. >> the 225, maybe 230 house republicans that won their elections in their district and represent their 600,000 people and actually probably got a much higher percentage of the vote in their district, a much, much higher percentage of the vote in their district than the president, they won, as well. and so they have a mandate, as well. and jon meacham, for some reason, you would think this president as a state legislator would understand those dynamics. >> it's very -- >> that's a great point. >> but he doesn't. >> what is he supposed to do with those dynamics? >> understand what the other guy feels like. pick your percentage. that's a huge part of what --

no, no, no -- a huge -- 47. it's a huge part of what politics is. henry kissinger's insight, if you're ever going to win a negotiation. if you're going to have a result, you have to give the other guy a way out. >> but that is a way out. i mean, that is such an easy way out. are we talking about taxes -- raising tax rates on the extremely wealthy. >> but they've got to get something else. >> hold on a second, though. that's the president's world view. and god bless him and there are a lot of people who believe that. i don't believe that raising taxes on the wealthy will raise taxes on the super wealthy. we know it. warren buffett was here and he said you'll raise the top marginal rate to 39.6, he's not going to pay any more taxes, bill gates won't pay any more taxes, the hedge funders won't. rich guys in greenwich aren't going to pay any more taxes, rich hollywood stars aren't going to pay more taxes because they've got the best accountants and lawyers in the world.

so when i see somebody say, oh, let's raise the marginal rate 5 percentage points, i'm thinking of the owners of bagel heads in pensacola, florida, their taxes are going to go up 5%. i'm thinking about a small accounting firm in poughkeepsie, new york, that's going to have to lay off a couple of staff members because their taxes will go up 5 percentage points. i'm thinking about a parent that's going to have to make a decision at work because they have to send another kid to school because, listen, for millionaires, 5% more in taxes, we'll wash it out, we'll give more to charity, we'll do this. for somebody making $250,000 -- and i've got to say, when the white house comes forward and says only 2% of small business owners actually file and are affected by this. i sit there and go, this shows how little they know. they act as if there's this huge chinese wall between a small business owner and the decisions

he or she makes when they go home about sending their kids to a college that they want to send them to, or -- or, you know, doing something else. >> so obviously my world view is impacting my ability to completely understand that. i hear that it makes sense. having said that, we're hearing from republicans who have been bashing the president's policies for four years saying it will be the end of the world, it will be the end of this country's economy. and actually, things are looking up, if you look at -- >> they're not saying that. >> -- the data. >> they're not saying that. i'm saying small business owners will be hurt. >> yeah. >> if you raise taxes. but -- we're talking about compromise. this is my view. you've got your view. you know what the answer is? >> yeah. >> getting together and talking saying, listen, this is what i can live with. you know what? 39.6% is offensive, even raising it 1 percentage point is offensive. why don't we do what warren buffett says and anybody that makes $1 million or more pays

30%, a minimum tax rate of 30%. and you raise the level up to $500,000 instead of $250,000 and i'll go ahead and reluctantly agree to raise the top rate to 37%. that's how deals are done, but you never get there if you don't have a president and congress -- >> but they can't do that now. >> why can't they do that? >> it's the centerpiece of their argument since the campaign and tim geithner on the sunday shows. they say there is no deal about raising taxes on the wealthy. >> and they're right. the matter of political reality, no deal will be done with that higher marginal rates on the wealthiest. but i think the president and the white house could do itself a favor if they stop talking about this with glee. if they stop talking about the whole deal involves raising taxes on the wealthy. they should say that's part of a bigger package, and they need to talk about spending cuts and why that's important too. i think that would make republicans feel better and strengthen their hand -- >> they think they have a political winning hand by talking about tax cuts on the

rich. >> and they do. >> and jay carney is now saying republicans, oh, they're only going to be happy if they can give rich people tax cuts. now they've morphed raising taxes to tax cuts for the rich. he's playing out of a 1995 playbook and, yes, they won the election using a class warfare argument and god bless them. they're not going to win reelection. because he's not running again. when's he going to realize that? >> just a matter of -- >> and by the way, jon, i'm sorry, he's not running for reelection again, the 225 or 35 republicans are running for reelection. and i would tell every one, if he doesn't come to you with a deal, do not vote to raise taxes a cent. don't do it. don't do it. you'll get beaten and washington will spend that money and they won't cut again and the deficit will be $18 trillion a couple of years from now. okay. now go ahead. >> why the conversation to some extent isn't about phrases like

disciplined investment. mark's exactly right. it's all about, we're going to make the rich pay. and the fair share gets close to that. but it's always about what we're going to raise. the first part of the conversation is taxes going up. and i think people are willing to pay more if they knew they were going to get more for it. >> right. >> and that's what you kind of never hear. that's sort of the second way -- the third train car down. politically, this has always worked when tax cuts were sold as freedom and tax increases were sold as investments. historically when you look back at the political way taxes were raised and taxes were cut, it was always seeing in a larger principled way. not simply just because that's the moment. >> right. >> and that's where the rhetoric's missing, and that's where the substance of this is missing. and also, if you raise them too fast, guess what you get, you get beat the next time.

>> and also, mika, if you raise them too fast, the president's talking about -- and this is crazy. crazy, this is psycho talk. this is crazy. the president's saying, okay, listen, here's the deal, we're going to have to raise taxes a lot, and it's going to slow down the economy. so we're going to have to do a $50 billion stimulus plan, as well. so you're raising taxes that are going to slow down the economy and then you've got to spend more money to get the economy going again. there is a deal to be had, though, and republicans will vote to raise taxes. and they'll even -- i would predict -- vote to raise taxes on the rich as far as marginal rates a couple of percentage points, but they're going to have to meet in the middle. >> takes two to make this happen behind closed doors. and if they're releasing their counter plan which is as comical as you say the president's was to the press -- >> i said the republican plan was comical too, didn't i? >> well, yeah, and not even directly brought to the white house.

taken out into the echo chamber, which is just like throwing red meat on the table. it's ridiculous. >> so is that the fig leaf you're holding today? >> no. >> it's a stupid offer. but the fact that they put it out to the press -- i mean the white house puts national security things out to the press, leaks classified information to the press. >> come on, that's grasping. you're grasgrasping. >> read the "new york times." if this is the standard now, if you leak something to the press, they leak classified information to the press to make the president look tough. one other thing, governor alexander and an old speaker who was later governor and they used to start every conversation -- >> willie, he's about to tell us another old boring history story. >> it's a short, boring history story. the conversation started with, what can you live with? >> yeah. >> and let's get there. >> right. >> it's homespun. >> that's how you do it, though.

that really is how you do it. >> what can you live with, mika? would you like me to go off a couple blocks? >> no, we love hearing your insight. -- invited to the white house last night. >> were they? >> christmas party. >> jeffersonian hospitality. >> it's like a convenient thing. he doesn't want to socialize except he does. >> except this is the first time in the history that republicans have been invited to white house christmas parties. oh, wait, no, that happens every year. >> they're all moving toward the same goal in one direction. >> oh, god. don't even say it. stop that right now. i can't hear that again. i can't. >> i think you should play your report. can you upload your report? >> you can't hear me there are so many screaming girls. i have never heard such a high-pitch -- it was deafening. >> you were shocked by this? >> coming up, tony blair's going to be here to talk about the new

sensation one direction, also arianna huffington and co-chair of the house republican conference kathy mcmorris rodgers. up next -- >> oh, god, i'm sorry. we were doing so well. you were like on a roll. >> -- military operation. jim vandehei's here with the top stories, but first here's bill karins with a check of the forecast. >> big letdown. >> bill, i'm putting on my bathing trunks and going to the shore. >> knee length or mid thigh? >> it goes down to the knee. >> that's classy. good morning, everyone. as joe was mentioning, the incredible warmth continues in so many areas of the country. yesterday was nice, today even better on the eastern seaboard. one exception, right around new york city, just for a few hours this morning, some light rain moving through. bring the umbrella, anywhere

around the tri-state area, southern connecticut, long island, or they're in new jersey. it's kind of isolated, though, much of new england will be dry. and you're pretty dry around the d.c. area this morning. temperatures already warming up. look at pittsburgh, it's 54. how hot will it get? it's hot this time of the year, 73 in washington, d.c., record heat is possible, new york city could get into the mid-60s and new england after a chilly start. we're going to warm up to the mid to upper 50s. probably one of the warmest days we should see till the spring. middle of the country, a few showers this morning around st. louis and down through the ozarks. it's just warm temperatures that got everyone's attention, even the southeast today in the 70s, texas in the 70s and another rainstorm for the west coast. and by the way, this is it for the east coast, tomorrow's cold front goes through, slightly cooler, but it won't be cold. no cold air in sight, no snowstorms in sight all the way through the upcoming weekend,

incredible, that'll take us into the middle of december without feeling like winter. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. music is a universal language. but when i was in an accident... i was worried the health care system spoke a language all its own with unitedhealthcare, i got help that fit my life. information on my phone.

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with unlimited talk and text. get a droid razr m by motorola for $49.99. it's 28 past the hour. time now to take a nice quiet look at the morning papers. we'll start with the "los angeles times," the u.s. and its allies are weighing possible military action in syria after new intelligence indicates that the assad regime may be preparing to unleash chemical weapons in the ongoing civil war. president obama issued a strong warning tells president assad not to cross that red line. from our parade of papers, "seattle times," flu season off to the earliest start in a decade, and the strain making the rounds tends to make people more sick than other versions,

particularly dangerous for the eld elderly. typically spikes in january or february. the "new york times" this holiday shopping season, toy makers are catering to a growing number of dads who are increasingly making the buying decisions for the families. one example, for the first time in 50 years, mattell has introduced construction barbie and a barbie building set designed with male shoppers in mind. some stores are being reorganized to appeal more to male sensibilities. the reason why they are shopping more is because they can sit their butts down in a big chair with their laptops and buy online. >> speaking of mean, willie -- >> i need some clarification. so grown men are buying barbie dolls because they're doing construction? >> don't -- >> sorry. don't pretend you don't know that. >> i don't quite understand the story. >> you know i wake up early every morning, and so saturday and sunday morning, i -- i go to my -- and by the way, i always buy christmas eve, buy presents from noon till 4:00.

every christmas eve. >> you do that. >> the worst shopper ever. i've gone on amazon -- >> have you? >> i've bought everything. i bought an american girl doll, i bought -- i mean -- >> and what did you get for your daughter? >> boom! >> it'll be right back. >> let's go to the politico playbook. jim vandehei, good morning. >> good morning, how are you? >> i'm doing all right. you've got this exciting new series at "politico" called behind the curtain. tell us about it. >> it's a new column, and short web show that mikey and i are doing once a week taking you behind the scenes in politics and policy. what drives the directions of things in congress and the white house. >> we're starting off with the rubio/ryan makeovers. >> yeah, tonight, both of them giving side-by-side speeches to

the foundation. and both of them are trying to do personal makeovers and makeovers for the party. marco rubio who i think is in a tier in his own, so far ahead of anybody else if he decides to run, he's worried about just being the hispanic candidate. so he's going to start adding substantive accomplishments to his record. he has a two-year plan between now and 2014, november of 2014 to try to notch some specific accomplishments on immigration and on the economic front. so if and when he does run for president, he's not just the great communicator in the eyes of republicans, but somebody that has substantive accomplishments. for paul ryan, he doesn't want to be the austerity guy. so he too is looking at poverty, looking at immigration, and other issues to broaden his own portfolio. we have a great nugget in the piece about how in the campaign he wanted to go in inner cities, talk about poverty, and he got slapped back by the romney folks who said there's no constituency, there's no votes, we're not focusing on those

issues. >> what's the next act for paul ryan coming off a losing vice presidential bid? what does he do four years from now or eight years from now? >> from my reporting, it's clear that rubio wants it and wants it badly. and i think wanting it matters when running for president. if you want it badly, you'll do all that stuff. we understand from folks talking to paul ryan, he doesn't want it as badly and isn't sure he wants to run. for the next two years, he's front and center in the fiscal debate. is he going to be the leader of resistance among conservatives or part of the solution? and i don't think he's made a decision yet. early signals are he's not where john boehner and others are as far as his openness to certain compromises, but at the end of the day, he could be there and i think that will be a big indication of what he wants to do and where he goes. >> and paul ryan signed on to the boehner plan yesterday. jim vandehei, "behind the curtain" is the new series. thanks so much. >> thanks, willie. appreciate it. up next, rookie of the year

candidate rg3 and the washington redskins look to close the gap in the nfc east on the new york giants. mike barnicle going to join us next. [ knock on door ] cool, you found it. wow. nice place. yeah. [ chuckles ] the family thinks i'm out shipping these. smooth move. you used priority mail flat-rate boxes. if it fits, it ships for a low, flat rate. paid for postage online and arranged a free pickup. and i'm gonna track them online, too. nice. between those boxes and this place, i'm totally staying sane this year. do i smell snickerdoodles? maybe. [ timer dings ] gotta go. [ male announcer ] priority mail flat rate boxes. online pricing starts at $5.15. only from the postal service.

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welcome back to "morning joe." 6:37. time for some sports. robert griffin iii making his monday night football debut last night against the giants. in the first quarter, the redskins down a field goal. watch this play. rg3 hits the corner. >> it's an option. >> ball comes loose. see if he can follow that. pops right up, josh morgan catches it out of the air. redskins take a 7-3 lead there. same score late in the second quarter. eli for the touchdown. giants led 13-10 at halftime. fourth quarter now, griffin rolling to his right, fires a bullet to pierre garson for the touchdown. that was the eventual game-winner, 17-16 at that point, stayed that way. redskins first win over the giants on monday night football since 1985. rg3, 235 total yards and that touchdown.

redskins 5-11 last year, now 6-6, won three in a row and a game behind the giants for the nfc east lead tied with the cowboys. that was a big game, the giants could've opened up a big lead on the cowboys. >> i think it's very nice of eli, very considerate for him to have this mid-season slump just to give everybody at the "new york post," "daily news" to come back and say negative things about him. >> there's a pattern. >> he pulls them in. >> but now it's time if you're 7-5, if you only have four games left, time to go back on the upswing. we've had our valley. >> rex ryan, man, i'm losing patience with this guy. he's saying he might put sanchez in this week. he doesn't know what he's going to do. sanchez, absolutely deplorable, we love the guy, he's nice, situation's horrible. they put in the quarterback, they win, and he's thinking about going back to sanchez? >> he's too cute about it. give him a shot.

>> mark sanchez looked far too happy to be on the sideline. he looked far too happy being on the sideline. andrew luck, russell wilson, two great quarterbacks, rg3 is going to end up being the face of the national football league. >> what a class of quarterbacks, though, this year. >> phenomenal. >> and i couldn't have been any more wrong about andrew luck. that guy's amazing. but i was saying you should go with rg3 instead of andrew luck. you can't fail with either of those two guys. they're incredible. >> and russell wilson. if he wasn't playing in seattle, he'd be the biggest media star. >> and rg3, i hear is a great guy. >> yeah. >> he said the guy was the most down to earth -- >> yep, all three of them are really classy guys. baseball now. the yankees, just so you know -- >> there's a good sign. >> they still owe alex rodriguez $17 million.

>> they'll be writing him checks in boca. he's got another hip replacement, willie. >> going to be out at least half of this next season because of a hip injury. the yankees announced he's going to have surgery in january to repair a bone impingement. >> it happened to him in the same night he was trying to get the girl's phone number. >> oh. >> the "new york post" reports. the pivot was too fast. >> he probably won't be able to be back until june or july, early july, right? >> just in time to bench him. >> did they build a ramp to third base to get him down there? how are they going to do this? >> this has political implications for the next generation. because my son thinks the failure of capitalism when it comes to rodriguez are self-evident. he says why did they give him so much money -- >> because they're the yankees. >> but, see, we cannot have a marked economy under such

assault. >> did he say that? >> maybe something different. but it's what i said back. >> you should have a talk with your son. i'm not big on parenting tips. >> long-term contracts, not a good thing. >> too many stories about everett dirkson from dad. >> are you going to parallel park later? >> i nailed that, by the way. >> yesterday, they agreed to a three-year $39 million contract, power hitting catcher and first baseman mike napoli. napoli has enjoyed huge success at fenway park in his career hitting .306, four doubles and 62 at bats. red sox reportedly onele of eight teams in talks with the mets for trading for the cy young winner r.a. dickey. what do you think? >> not going to happen. >> the napoli deal is a good deal. you'll put up 30 to 35 home runs. >> you'll take it.

>> when is axelrod taking his mustache off? >> i think december 7th. >> friday? >> the 7th. >> that's this friday. >> that is a nice thing. >> nice of fenway, fundraiser at fenway. we're close to $1 million. >> we need more. >> the president put some money in. that's nice. >> yeah, the president is now -- >> i called him. >> you called the president to get him to pay money? >> he wants david to shave his mustache. >> he wants to see it. up next, mika's must-read opinion pages, "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. you won't take my life.

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did you see that picture, mika? as we look at this beautiful shot. >> it was fantastic. >> of thomas jefferson's hometown, washington, d.c. look at this picture of meacham. you know what that's the look of? >> what? >> the number one best selling "new york times" author. he's redefined publishing in america. >> was that taken with his own personal photographer? >> oh, here we go. >> i don't know, did they have cameras when you were coming up? let's be really original. >> i struck a nerve with that one. >> did strike a nerve. >> when matthew brady was taking your shots. >> a lincoln joke, i love it. >> he's changed. >> there's nothing like -- he is, he's kind of like heilemann. >> this is the place to come. >> you're kind of like heilemann. he changes after "game change" goes big. >> no, heilemann -- you are no heilemann. >> are you going to start smoking crack next? >> no, don't worry.

>> you've changed on me. >> you have changed. >> since you went number one, you changed. >> no -- >> do we want to go into it, mr. -- >> oh. >> -- spewing uncontrollable verbal -- >> jon -- >> he's a national treasure. >> john heilemann's a national treasure. >> he is a national treasure. >> that says so little of our nation. >> switch topics here. >> yeah, it's such a national treasure that we're keeping him under lock and key for a while. and we're not going to let him back on the show. >> he has self-control issues. >> here's mika reading david brooks. >> the truly grand bargain. >> a dramatic read. >> listen, please, this is very, very interesting. you just might -- >> you're serious. >> if you're not careful, you may learn something. go ahead.

>> exactly. a budget stalemate on these terms will confirm every bad republican stereotype. republicans will be raising middle class taxes in order to serve the rich. shafting sam's club to benefit the country club. if republicans do this, they might as well get mitt romney's 47% comments printed on t-shirts and wear them for the rest of their lives. so republicans have to realize that they are going to cave on tax rates. the only question is what they get in return. what they get should demand -- what they should demand is this, that the year 2013 will be spent putting together a pro-growth tax and entitlement reform package that will put this country on a sound financial footing through 2040. what's wrong with that? >> nothing's wrong with that. but can anybody do it? is the art of the deal dead in washington? that's the question. >> very good, mike barnicle. >> not to shock you, mika, i

disagree. don't cave, compromise. and if not willing to compromise -- >> yes, that's the difference. >> if they're not willing to compromise, don't cave. >> republicans that won in their districts, landslides, they can stare down the president and just wait. don't wait, but do compromise. and there's no sense this president wants to compromise. and right now, there's no sense that republican leaders actually want to put real cuts on the table. $2 trillion, i'm sorry, we -- the starting point is $4 trillion. and even if we cut $4 trillion over the next ten years, we're going to go even deeper in debt than that. but don't cave. >> that's an -- >> compromise. >> it's a really important distinction. >> would a compromise include ticking up the marginal rate on the top earners so it's not 39.6%, but it's 37%. the president has to get something. >> and by the way, we talk about the art of the deal, mike talks about the art of the deal. i could see and the numbers

would add up if you said to the president you're going to have to give us a lot more in cuts. we're going to have to be more aggressive in reforming medicare, medicaid. and let's pass the warren buffett tax where rich, the super rich, millionaires and above pay 30% minimum, and that'll raise a couple -- i think $150 billion, $200 billion, and then raise the $250,000 level to $500,000, and if you're a republican say we're not going up to 39.6%, but if you do all this and give us the cuts we need, then we'll meet you half way and raise marginal rails at 37%. i don't know, the white house probably won't do that, but -- that's a deal. >> doesn't that get to one of the questions implicit in this entire debate that's going to go on, it appears. can the democrats who have the white house and the united states senate, can they put together, fashion a deal that

makes the republicans feel a lot better about themselves at the end of the day with the concessions they're going to have to make? >> i don't think the republicans have to feel better about themselves. i don't think the republicans have to even feel good about themselves. i think you give them a deal they can't refuse. and, you know, you said you always ask the question in all mediations and negotiations, what can you live with? and by the way, i can tell you in my personal life as a lawyer, as a congressman, as a subcommittee chairman, as a guy that's negotiated my contracts with general electric and comcast, i always go into the negotiations, the first thing i think of is, okay, what's going to make the other guy or woman feel like they got the best of me. >> exactly. >> how do i make them feel that they're actually getting the best of me when i'm getting what i want out of it. >> absolutely. >> and you do that at every negotiation, and you push and you scream and scratch and claw

and fight. ask phil griffin. we're always -- we'll get on the phone and we'll yell and kick and scream. but we'll always have the end goal in mind. and i always end up going, what's going to make phil look good? >> right. >> what's going to make before jeff now steve burke feel good, like they got the best of me. >> right. >> and i'm going to give them that, but i'm going to take what i've always wanted all along. and it's money. give them what they want. but it's -- it's a deal. you figure out what they can give up, they figure out what you can give up and you do the deal and everybody walks away. every deal i've ever done, everybody walks away feeling like they won. >> and you know who made a life out of that? was the labor negotiator ronald reagan. >> yeah. >> brian cashman's on the phone for you, joe. he's listened to that. he wants to talk to you about how to get rid of alex

rodriguez. >> actually, he wants you to play third base. >> well, you know, i've got two good hips. >> there you go. >> two more than a-rod. second hip replacement. >> that's terrible. former british prime minister tony blair joins us onset, also ron fournier will be here to discuss about his cover in the national journal. and coming up, arianna huffington onset. more "morning joe" in just a moment. [ male announcer ] when this hotel added aflac

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up next, arianna huffington joins us onset. also eugene robinson joins the conversation. keep it right here on "morning joe." we'll be right back. [ male announcer ] if you're eligible for medicare...

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there's something about this i actually don't understand. if the republicans can filibuster anything the democrats propose, then how can the democrats reform the filibuster without being filibustered? >> democrats have said they won't move forward on any changes before january. when the 113th congress begins. at that point, under conditions that only apply on the first day of a new session, they could alter the senate rules by a simple majority. >> now you're just making [ bleep ] up. what kind of rule is that? well, we can't do it except on the first day of a new session when o'ryan is in the house of the rising sun and it's opposite day and the girl senators get to ask the boy senators to the dance. crazy rules like these get in the way. how do you expect anything to get done? >> the senate was not established to be efficient. >> well, mission [ bleep ] accomplished. >> welcome back to "morning joe."

mike barnicle and mark haleprin are still with us as we take a live look at the white house. the co-founder of the "huffington post" arianna huffington. and associate editor of "the washington post," eugene robinson. great to have you both onboard this hour. >> arianna, you've talked about it for some time. the party system is so broken. washington is so broken. we're seeing democrats and republicans do the same dance they did a year ago except they seem to be even further apart. >> they're further apart, but also, there's something interesting happening. i just wrote about, which is if you listen to the president's speech in pennsylvania, he's really only making one appeal. and this is the $2,000 that's going to be in your pocket if this compromise that he wants goes through. there's no other appeal. there's no appeal to growing the country, coming together,

rebuilding the economy. it's just -- remind me of 1996 of newt gingrich. remember, he said there are three things, you know, you can reduce the republican message to three points, you know. earn more, keep more, do more. and, you know, when you have jon meacham here and the greatest j jefferson, and what this country has done. >> and the movie lincoln. >> and why is the assumption of politicians that the only appeal you can make to the public is to give more money to them. to let them keep more money? there's no other appeal anymore. >> well, but joe, don't you think at this point we're still seeing a game of chicken in the press? and that they should just get in a room and not come out. just not come out till it's done. >> why aren't they in a room, mark haleprin? >> there's several reasons. one is the president is not

willing to let republicans off the hook. he thinks they've got a lot more they need to give before. the other reason is, and this goes back to what willie was saying before about business people say why don't they get in a room? if the president, if this deal is seen as the president's deal with john boehner, it's going to be hard to get republican votes for it. they don't like the president. there's a very large number of republicans in the house who are against anything the president's -- they don't care what it is. >> is there anything that can be done to change that? that's uniform? >> well, in terms of the substance, i think the republicans want him to give in a lot more on spending in terms of theatrics, i think, they just need to realize that john boehner's going to have to deliver some number of republican votes, fewer than the number of democratic votes in the house. and that's tricky. as i said before, the deal amongst the leaders is the easy part, even though it looks hard right now getting it past the house. >> the fight isn't about whether the rich will pay more in taxes,

it's about whether this new revenue is collected in a way that allows house republicans to say they have kept their pledge. refusing to budge has served house republicans well in previous budget negotiations. but the no-taxes-ever-bulwark has not served the country well. and obama would be remiss not to try. go ahead, eugene. >> obama has talked about -- he phrased it as breaking the fever, i think, at one point. this sort of solid wall of adamanting opposition to any sort of tax rate increase ever in the house has been seen as a problem to him from day one. and coming off the election, he's in a stronger political position than he's been in before.

his incentive is not to rush into the room, his strength is out among public opinion where that's friendlier terrain for him. whereas once they get in the room, of course, republicans still have power, still have control of the house. >> yeah. >> so there's no great incentive for him to rush to compromise at this point. >> gene, why is -- why is raising the top marginal rate so important to the president as well as liberals across america? why -- explain why the is that so important? >> well -- >> and i'm talking specifically the top marginal rate. not taxes on the rich. because the rich have been skating by for too long. i've said it it's immoral that billionaires pay 14% while people that do their lawns pay 28%. that's immoral. but why is the top marginal rate the waterloo? >> well, i think because that --

that's a sort of keystone indicator, i guess, of how progressive your tax system is. and it's pretty low now. you know compare it to the clinton era rates, which is kind of all we're talking about, right? going back to the clinton era rate of 39% -- >> is it about fairness? or is it about lessening the deficit? because it doesn't really do a whole lot for the debt or deficit over ten years. >> well, it's about fairness, but it's also about what are the better options? given that the wealthy are really skating by these days. and so how do you collect more revenue from them? and all the various ideas about, well, you cap this deduction, and cap that deduction. there are not only political constituencies that will fight tooth and claw on every deducti deduction, there are some reasons, fairly good reasons why you would want to think twice.

you know, are you going to go after home mortgage deduction at a time when the housing industry is trying to get its feet? are you going to go after the exemption on taxation for health insurance? i mean, that's the biggest one, actually. that's like $250 billion a year. but i don't think anybody wants to dive back into that at this point. so, you know, how else are you going to do it? >> arianna, can i just say that -- and this is -- i guess i've been articulate. let me try to go at it another direction here. we could raise the top marginal tax rate from 35% to 75%. and hedge fund operators out of new york and greenwich would still be paying 14% taxes with this tax code. hollywood moguls would still be paying 14%, 15%, 16% with this tax code. wall street ceos would be

paying -- you could raise our tax rate to 99%, and the richest of the rich would still be paying 14%. that's why i wonder why they're fighting over something. at the end of the day, doesn't make the tax system more just or fair to working class or middle class people. >> but as eugene said, if we're trying to get a certain amount of revenue, and the alternative the republicans are proposing is closing some loopholes, they're not very precise about, this is an easy way to get a certain amount of revenue. remember, when the bush tax cuts were passed, they were supposed to be temporary. they were never supposed to be permanent. and on top of it, for me, the bigger question is the fiscal cliff debate rather than a growth cliff debate is what we've got wrong. >> whatever the news is, at this point, everyone -- it comes down to certainty, whatever it is, doesn't it at this point? joining us now from capitol

hill, maybe we'll get an answer here, republican representative from washington and the new chairwoman of the house republican conference, congratulations, congresswoman, kathy mcmorris rodgers, good to have you on the show this morning. >> thanks. >> great to have you here. >> great to be with you. >> you've heard part of this debate. >> yes. >> how do republicans knowing we have to raise revenue, how do republicans raise the type of revenue that needs to be raised? >> well, republicans believe that this is the time for big solutions, for laying out that framework so it's not just a quick fix, but a appraisal fix. and as you were just talking about, the rates, what we really need that -- focusing on the top 2% is really a straw man. what we need is a tax reform in america for middle class families and for our economy, but we also need to address the spending. we need to address the debt. and that's where the republicans -- the day after the election, speaker boehner went

to the podium and he said we're putting revenue on the table. closing the loopholes so that the wealthiest americans would be paying more. >> okay. so fixing it for the long-term is something i think that everybody wants on both sides of the aisle. i think there is a good amount of concern about our fiscal health as a country. having said that, let me ask about your colleagues in congress. is there something that they can be given that uniformly will have them come to the table for compromise? because the problem is not getting into a room and cutting a deal with boehner. it's boehner bringing it back to you all. and then you all not going there. what is it? and maybe you can't be that specific, but what would it be? and is it possible that there's something that would lead this situation to a compromise? >> well, the republicans believe that it's not just about the revenue side, but that we must be looking at the spending, the out of control spending, the --

>> that's what i'm asking about. >> yes, and looking at entitlements, that's where we get the long-term certainty for our middle class families that are dependent upon these programs as well as for our economy. and the republicans want -- want that kind of a deal. that is what president reagan and tip o'neill did back in the '80s. and this is our moment, our chance, and my colleagues are right there with me. we believe that we can't just keep having this debate. we might avoid this fiscal cliff, but there's going to be another one right after that. >> congresswoman, if -- let's say you get what you need, what republicans need, what conservatives like i would need if i were in your position right now, which is significant reform on medicare. which are significant cuts in defense, significant cuts in discretionary spending. some loopholes closed. if part of the deal was meeting the president halfway, say 37%

instead of 39.6%, would that be a possibility for the majority of our caucus? >> well, you know, the republicans do not believe that increasing rates really solves the problem. what we believe is we need tax reform and that's where we have been putting those kind of proposals on the table. >> and i believe that too. my question is this, though. do republicans believe that a deal is so necessary that if the president is willing to give on entitlements and spending and other discretionary spending and other areas that he doesn't want to give on that republicans understand they may have to do some things they don't like doing. one of that may be meeting the president half way on raising the top marginal tax rate. >> well, we need to get the negotiations underway. and we need the president to come into those negotiations. we need him to be serious. him to be looking at the spending reductions, the entitlement reforms, and, unfortunately, his most recent

proposal, it was higher taxes than ever, and another stimulus, more wasteful spending. >> right. >> rather than really looking at this other side of the equation. and that's going to be so important. >> and i agree with you and i'm going to assume that your answer means if they came with significant -- i do think, mike, it is -- it is so washington. it's such a washington idea to say, you know what we're going to do? we're going to raise taxes on people, and it's going to slow down the economy, so we need another stimulus spending plan. that's your idea -- >> mike -- >> away from a fiscal cliff? >> congresswoman, i am a financial illiterate, can you explain to me how you have all encompassing tax reform without taking a look at tax rates? >> well, we have. we believe that we need tax reform. we'd like to look at tax rates, we'd like to look at the loopholes, the tax credits.

we want a simpler, less costly tax code for america. that's important for middle class families, important for our economy. that is what's going to help get this economy growing again. but we also -- it also republicans believe it has to include the spending. and the way congress has operated in the past, you know, yeah, we'll increase revenue, but then there's never the protections, never the tough decisions to actually cut the spending, reduce the debt, and that has to be a part of this one. >> fair enough. arianna? >> congresswoman, in your thanksgiving message, twice you emphasize the need for jobs, the need for growth, and then you mentioned the deficit. what do you think we should be doing right now to help create jobs and bring about greater growth? >> well, one of the first things in these negotiations would be to get serious about tax reform. that is -- and provide that certainty for middle class families so we don't continue to have this debate a year from

now. >> yeah. >> but also for our job creators so they can go out there and start making some decisions. start hiring, getting people back to work. i think the tax reform and getting this framework in place would be the best thing we can do for our economy, which would also bring revenue to the federal government. >> there's that word certainty, which we would fully understand. congresswoman, if there is not a deal reached, would you characterize that as a massive failure on the part of congress? in fact, both sides? >> yeah, i believe we either are going to succeed together or fail together. and i go back to the model from president reagan and tip o'neill in the early '80s. as they look at tax reform as well as these entitlement programs, that's the approach we need today. proven that it can be done. and we need president obama to come to the table, provide that leadership, the republicans are willing. speaker boehner is ready today. let's get the job done. >> all right. congresswoman kathy mcmorris

rodgers. thank you for coming on the show. come back, glad you're there in the negotiations talking to everybody. >> eugene robinson, final thoughts this block? >> well, you know, actually congress and the president have agreed on a huge deficit reduction package. it's called the fiscal cliff. so, you know, in my darker moments, i think we're going over it, and what if we went over it and the world didn't end? that would be kind of interesting. we'd take a big bite out of the deficit and everybody's taxes would go up, but i think the sun would come up tomorrow. >> huh. >> we may find out. >> okay, little orphan annie. >> so, gene, do you think right now that's you advise the president to do if the republicans don't come forward with more specifics? >> if i'm advising the president right now i'm advising him to wait a while. and that maybe when we get closer to the date, the calendar

will concentrate the minds of many people in washington and a conversation will be more fruitful. >> all right. >> okay. eugene robinson, thank you. still ahead, the former british prime minister tony blair joins us next. and next, the "national journal's" ron fournier tells us his touching cover story next. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. americans are always ready to work hard for a better future. since ameriprise financial was founded back in 1894,

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joining us now at 22 past the hour. editorial director of the "national journal" ron fournier. his cover story in the new issue super bowl about how he learned to accept his son's aspberger's

syndrome. two eye-opening visits with former presidents bill clinton and george w. bush. that'll do it. at the end of their journey, ron concluded this in part, quote, rather than sweat over it, i now realize how much i'd miss if he was ant an aspie, his humor, bluntness, obsessions with everything from video games to family. i saw through both presidents a successful future in tyler. in clinton, big possibilities for a boy with sharp mind and rough edges. in bush, tyler's gift of humor as a means to find confidence in himself and connections with others. i learned that while tyler was not my idealized son, he was the ideal one. in the oval office years ago, i thought bush had ordered me to love that boy in spite of his idiosyncrasies, now i realize i love my son because of them. okay. i'm going to cry. that's beautiful. >> thank you. >> sounds like an incredible

journey for both of you. >> it was. it was my wife's idea. and it's a remarkable gift she gave us to make us go on the road together. and the two presidents, the graciousness they showed in spending time with tyler, i could never thank them enough. >> and i guess it's something about when you're having trouble with one of your kids and it frustrates you, the only thing you can do to really get it is to get in their face and to really expose yourself to them one on one in some sort of challenging or extended period of time. it opens your eyes. >> that's been a big surprise with this story. i wrote it to try to get to know him a little bit better and spend some time with him. and i was really surprised by the outpouring from people saying even if they have children who don't have special needs, that boy, that really means a lot to me to see myself in you that i have to have a good work/life balance, that i need to stop trying to fit my beautiful round peg in a square hole. >> i love the story of the

interaction with president clinton. they had this conversation about teddy roosevelt and the president went on a monologue for ten minutes and didn't realize he had completely lost tyler, your son, and you said, well, here's the president of the united states who is unbelievably charming and seductive and he missed the clues. >> yeah. >> in a way that tyler misses the clues despite his sharp mind and all his other gifts. >> the neat thing is, tyler -- i said what did you think, tyler? on the way out. he talked about the stuff he really likes. i said like you, buddy? and he said, yeah, kind of like me. and i actually wrote this in my notebook. just to give you a sense how it hit me. i covered clinton for 25 years, and in a moment i wrote is he an aspie. i know he's not, but we're all kind of in a way on that spectrum. we all have issues with connecting with one another. and he could not have been more

gracious. he knew that teddy roosevelt was a big thing in tyler's life. he gave my son a 1919 edition of roosevelt's letters to his children, signed it. it was wonderful. >> i would imagine you connect with this story, extremely well. >> oh, yeah. yeah. i've got a son who has aspbergers. so when did you first realize your son had it? because it's frustrating after even more frustrating before going what? okay. what's going on here? >> yeah. well, we knew we had a beautiful, lovely quirky boy having a hard time connecting and making friends, but we didn't know what was going on. and we just thought it was, you know, another -- we have three kids, two older, and every one you treat a different way. my wife was watching "parenthood" a drama on this network and she saw the max braverman character who is further higher on the scale on my son, he has more challenges. but she told me when i got home

that night, you have to watch this show. and i spent that night, i missed five or six episodes, on the computer watching it with tears pouring down my eyes realizing that, hey, this might be. my boy might be autistic. and part of it was a relief. >> and that is for parents with kids with asperger's, that's the relief. figuring out what goes on here. >> there's a defining moment as you all were with president bush, i want to -- i want to quote this. tyler's first encounter with president bush made you cringe. he's sitting there with bush and he says, they originated from scotland, they can be traced back to a single female, if president roosevelt had one, he call -- dad kept him in the office down where he was swimming, there's one in monopoly, my favorite car is the -- my favorite is the car on

and on and on. >> does that ring a bell to you? >> it does. i remember one time when andrew was younger, there were my wife's cousin came. she had a daughter who was a cheerleader. there were three other cheerleader. they were there and there were these cute, cute young girls and kept looking over and trying to connect. and finally he was typing, finally he looks up and he goes, i like bag pipes. and they stare at him, go baa to become their conversation, and i do what i'm sure you've done. i go, what was that? what are you doing? and he said, blink 82 has a song that has bag pipes on it and i like it. and i said, okay. this is what you do. and i'm sure you had the same experience. kids with asperger's you can teach them the social clues. i said, you look at the computer, you're listening to blink 82, you turn and ask, do you like blink 182? yes, i do. what's your favorite song?

do you know they have a song with bag pipes in it? and here's the remarkable thing. kids with asperger's. he would come in and start blurting out the most crazy -- and so i said, andrew, here's the deal, i'm going to pick you up from school, you turn and look to me and go, hey, dad, how was your day? and i go, it was fine, andrew, how was yours? and you think of the thing you like the most about your day in school and you tell me and after you're done, ask me what my -- how my day's been. and the remarkable thing was the next day i -- he comes in, he goes, hey, dad, how was your day? andrew, great. but that's what i found with aspies, not just andrew. they pick up the social cues and they want them, they love them, they need them. >> well, as you know, part of the syndrome, they're incredibly intelligent. he's got 30 iq points on me.

once you explain to him, this is how you conduct yourself in a conversation. we started this six months ago. how was your day, mom? and with -- part of the story unfolds and you show how he's learning the social cues with president clinton. he offered him a book with polar bears on it. apparently, finding a picture of polar bears footing is rare, i think only tyler and clinton know this. they're both fascinated by the picture and tyler says i can't accept this, sir, which is not the kind of thing you hear out of a 13-year-old, but that's how he's been taught. and throughout this journey, it was really neat to watch him take the lessons he's learning in school and goes to a school where he has social skills training. >> right. >> and using them with people. it's heartwarming. >> and mike, you have a daughter, she doesn't have asperger's, but we think we're going to get julia and andrew together because a lot of missed social clues there. >> they're so great. wonderful -- they're so great.

the olive garden story. that was just one story, on that same trip, julie, i told her, we took the entire family, seven kids, one of the world's most expensive restaurants in paris and ann, my wife says to julia. you know, julia, isn't this place great? and she shouts out, this is great, this reminds me of the olive garden. >> i love her. >> on that same trip, collin got drunk, one of our boys and got in a fistfight in paris. >> why not? >> couldn't find him, down in the lobby, my wife is in tears, and julie goes up to my wife and says, mom, mom, don't worry, don't worry, mom, if i know collin, he's been kidnapped. but you have to savor these moments. >> isn't it great having kids who have no sense of spin? they're just totally blunt? >> that's the best part of it. >> isn't that wonderful? >> it is. >> also, what i've always said

with andrew and heard the same thing about julie, i'm sure the same thing with your son too. they do, they have heightened -- >> that's incredible. >> sensitivities elsewhere, and they will always -- they -- he always surprises me with keen insight. >> how old is andrew? >> he's 21 now. >> if you don't mind my asking, how old did you know -- >> it wasn't as well known then as it is now and we couldn't figure it out and i actually went to a pediatrician and kate was there and pediatrician asked what's going on? how you doing? doing fine. and then i just talked about -- she asked how joey was and andrew. and i said oh, andrew is trying to figure out. we were trying to figure out and i talked about three more minutes, he goes, he's got asperger's, look it up on the internet. and they list 20 things and andrew was 20 out of 20.

but it was a great relief for us because we'd been pulling our hair out for five or six years and you realize you can do social clues. anyone with a son or daughter with asperger's, keep them away from video games and tv as much as possible. make them interact, teach the social clues and cues because it really makes a huge difference. andrew, i have seen such an awakening in andrew. you know, we were told by one person that when andrew was in middle school, he wouldn't graduate from high school probably. >> i heard that too. >> andrew graduated from high school. he went to junior college. he got better grades in junior college than he got in high school. got better grades in high school than he got in middle school. he's now moved on and he's -- he got his aa degree, getting his bachelor's right now. getting better grades now than he got in his junior college. so i've seen an awakening, but so much of it is, again, picking

up the clues. give them the clues, they're smarter than a lot of their peers. they can -- you know, but it's so frustrating. >> and i wish there were more school systems like mine. my boy's in arlington public schools that have special programs for aspies. he's mainstream, but one of his elective classes teaches him those clues, in addition to help at home, getting it in school and he has people helping him out we have the resources and time to take care of tyler like you did with andrew. i really hate for people who don't. >> and that's concerns me. i said it's frustrating. it is frustrating to parents who don't have the support. and the big question is, do you mainstream your child or do you put them in a place that focuses more on kids with these challenges? we mainstreamed ours, we found a really small school in pensacola, east hill christian,

and they were wonderful, and the kids were wonderful to him. we felt so blessed. andrew, actually, it was of all the things that even my kids have done and i love them all and proud of them all, i always say tell joey trying out for the basketball team and not making it knowing you probably deidn't have a good chance to make it, i've never been more proud of you. and andrew, his senior year, he was on the homecoming court. >> aw. >> he could be elected president and we could not be any more proud. >> when he joined the new school he's in, one of the first things he did was enter into a talent show, got up on stage and did a comedy act. >> that's what andrew does. >> second place. >> you know how gutty that's got to be. >> incredibly. >> oh, my gosh. >> we need to talk and your son needs to talk to my son. that is andrew's obsession too. >> the cover story is in the new issue of "the national journal," ron fournier, thank you so much. >> thank you. >> very enriching.

really. coming up, he's the first living person to receive the medal of honor since the end of the vietnam war. keep it right here on "morning joe."

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don't be fooled, new york city, rain, cloudy, gloomy this morning, this afternoon, you could get in the mid-60s with sunshine. shower activity as the warm front tries to kick through. and the warm is the big story across the country for december. yesterday was one of the warmest days you're going to get from coast to coast. it's a little bit cooler in the midwest today. temperatures have dropped a little bit. but all that warm air still surging up from the gulf of mexico all the way up the eastern sea board. there is some rain out there. we did show you the new york city shot. i have other spots too, and notice this morning, it's still very warm out there, new orleans, starleting your morning at 70. the green on the map shows the rain there, it moves to new york city, it'll be over with in about an hour from now. also on the cold front, some rain moving through st. louis. eventually here shortly, detroit to indianapolis, columbus, louisville, lexington, and all the way down there toward

nashville a little later today. also, wet weather continues to push through the northwest, but not as bad as those big storms this past weekend. your forecast, the east coast, one more incredibly warm day, washington, d.c., if we get enough sunshine, you could head up into the mid-70s today, record highs, many spots from washington, d.c. all the way down through the southeast. enjoy it while it lasts. looks like we're going to cool off slowly over the next couple of days. a story of love and anarchy, karen avrich joins us. t there.

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44 past the hour. welcome back to "morning joe." joining us now, writer and editor karen avrich, co-editor of "sasha and emma." and it is great to have you. >> great reviews. "new york times." >> enormously rich book. >> holds an enormously rich book. >> thank you so much. really appreciate it. >> all right. so -- >> considering -- considering what you -- the limitations that you have every day. >> yes, it's a challenge to get anything done at all. >> yeah, i know. >> so you know mark? >> we've met. >> we try and keep him away for you for three hours a day. >> i really appreciate it. that's when i get things done. >> that's right. it's like having a toddler. you're a hostage. >> i appreciate it. >> okay. so tell us about this book. you finished your father's book. >> yes, my father was a

professor of russian history. he was always sort of drawn to the radical elements of the story. and he became interested in anarchism, and spent several decades sort of tracking down these anarchists who had been visible in the movement in the early part of the 20th century. and he always -- they all had these stories about these two people, emma goldman and he always planned to write a biography of them some day and became ill. so before his death in 2006, he asked me since i was -- you know, my professor is a writer and editor to take on the project. he handed over his notes and his photographs and his -- some drafts he had done and incredible interviews he had done. and i took on the project -- >> little daunting, isn't it? >> yeah, initially, he had just passed away and it was difficult for the family. and all of a sudden all i had in my head every day was his voice.

i felt a great responsibility to his legacy and to getting the book done. and then, gradually as i became more and more familiar with these characters, it was actually the story that took over. they're so fascinating. >> let's talk about these characters. sasha and emma. first of all, some say he committed the first act of terrorism. >> yes, he described it. >> tried to assassinate an industrialist. >> yes. both of them, sasha and emma were emigrants from russia. -- you'd be exiled or executed and that's how you got out your message. and so they came to america as teenagers, joined radical movements and they decided they wanted to sort of create an act to galvanize the workers and change society. and they chose -- after there was a labor dispute at the homestead steel mill that was -- the chairman of, they decided he would be their target. when sasha was 21, he armed himself with a gun and knife and

tried to kill him. >> failed, thrown in jail for 14 years. and he -- and let's talk about emma. she actually founded mother jones? >> she did. mother earth, actually, was her magazine. sort of a literary -- >> sorry. >> well, there's some similarity. >> there's some on the -- >> david corn never -- >> and he's not anarchist. she's also the author of the anarchist philosophy. wasn't she also a leader in women's rights? >> she was. she -- actually she talked a lot about women's rights, freedom of speech, freedom of assembly, birth control, she was anti-war. also was a student of the modern drama, gave a lot of lectures about that. she had a lot of interests. >> but she fought in the spanish civil war. >> she did. toward the end of her life. she felt it was the one last chance for anarchism to take hold of the country.

that was her last gasp in her 60s. >> i love a lot of figures part of emma and sasha's life were also part of your life. i remember the story that you spoke about one of emma's friends coming to you with a great box of belgian chocolates and later on you realized she had actually been a great friend of emma's. >> that's what's so extraordinary. when i was a little child, my father was spending time, inviting them over for tea, these anarchists, and they'd bring me chocolate and they were sort of nice elderly people with a dangerous twinkle in their eyes. but now when i started researching the book, i thought, oh, my goodness, this person fought alongside emma goldman in the spanish civil war. the friend of my father was with her when she died. >> i love the book. >> thank you very much. >> it was an incredible read. compelling characters, and all the intimate detail in the middle of all that history. >> thank you. >>. >> speaking of intimate detail.

>> one of the compelling parts of this book as karen was writing, they're smart, funny, they're really interesting, but as you can see from the cover of the book, they're not the most physically attractive people, right? >> hey. >> and yet, as you read the book, they're in their 50s and 60s and they both have significant others and flings with people like in their 20s and 30s. so the question is, and this is kind of a news you can use thing,. so the question is, and this is kind of a news you can use thing, how can relatively unattractive people in their 60s get all these younger dates? how did that happen? >> they both had incredible personalities. big personalities. sasha after committing this act became this legend, this hero, this martyr of the cause. he also had this dry wit and apparently some kind of charisma. he was constantly getting beautiful young girls it to fall in love with him. emma was the same way, she was a cougar. in her 50s and 60s she had boyfriends who were 20s and 30s.

there was a student and she propositioned him. he turned her down, but they were very good friends. actually my father talked to the taur of one of her lawyers. she had some intense charisma. >> some call her the demi moore of her times. "the new york times," though, described her as an encourageable revolutionist to the end. >> she was indeed. they never gave up their dreams. >> "sasha and emma." >> what does "the new york times" say about this book? >> enormously rich book. a great review. great to have you on. >> thank you for coming on. >> thank you for having me on my favorite show. >> it's about time. >> seriously. >> your favorite show because you get a break from halperin. >> and i enjoy the show. >> she watched the show before i was on it. >> i did. i tried to get him to watch. >> so you were responsible for mark? >> i would say for months, you

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friday on "morning joe" the close shave. cure. cure has raised nearly $750,000 but we need more. it's for epilepsy research. thanks to the slash the mustache fund-raising effort. we're nearly at the $1 million goal. we need it. >> we have to get the mustache off. did you know the president of the united states has found time in his busy sked schedule to actually get involved in this effort. >> he donated money. >> thank you for your contribution, joe. >> and thank you, mr. president,

for your contribution. >> david axelrod will donate his mustache on 0 the air. that could be kind of gross. >> it's going to happen. we will reach $1 million. >> oh, look i. >> tom coburn. we'll be talking to dr. brzezinski. >> frightening. >> be scared. >> and senator claire mccaskill. a triumphant return. >> fantastic. >> ahead on "morning joe" though, the white house says no to the republicans' fiscal cliff plan. it was a terrible plan. nobody has offered a good one yet. we have big dreams.

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good morning. it's 8:00 on the east coast. 5:00 on the west coast. time to wake up, everyone, and please, please, if you would, listen to the stage manager jen when she is trying to talk to you. okay? it's rude. i'm sorry. take a live look at new york city and back with us on set we have mark halperin and jon meacham, very unruly today. >> what's going on in washington? >> bad dynamics. those of us who wanted to be optimistic there would be a

deal, the white house has blasted boehner's counteroffer as much as the republicans blasted the president's, and they're just -- people like to say, oh, in the public they're going to posture. >> i hear chuck todd reported behind the scenes a top aide, willie geist. i'm not really good at reading the tea leaves. maybe this is good. maybe this is bad, but a top obama aide told chuck todd if these republicans were in power when abraham lincoln was there, there would still be slavery. does that help the process move along or does it hurt? >> reading it between the lines. i think that's a bad omen. we still have four weeks, though. >> yeah, absolutely. we have i believe 27 negotiating days. >> there is a rule in it life --

>> what is that rule? >> i think slavery analogies and hitler jokes never work out well. >> you don't do that. >> it never ends well. >> if you're a reporter, you do not need to sort of badge aer people at the white house or on the hill for negative stuff about the other side. they are reaching out to affirmatively blast -- >> who is they? >> people are looking for opportunities to blast the other side. >> the white house offer, the first offer, was in bad faith. it was pathetic. >> first offer? >> the counteroffer was in bad faith and pathetic. >> they released it to the press, i believe, before to the white house which i think is just -- >> it doesn't matter. these are two really pathetic offers. >> this is not the first rodeo on all of these issues.

everyone knows what everyone was willing to do 20 minutes ago and to revert doesn't make sense. >> you're the historian, jon, really quickly, and people may see this ideological on my part. it's not ideological on my part. 100 years from now nobody is going to remember john boehner's name, harry reid's name, nobody is going to believe for a second 20 years from now that john boehner and harry reid were the architects of any deal or any failu failure. when does the president realize he is sitting in the chair of th thomas jefferson, of abraham lincoln, of woodrow wilson, of t.r., of fdr, of jfk, of ronald reagan? when does he realize that and step up and do what abraham lincoln did and buy them off, charm them off, beat them up -- >> build a bridge to nowhere. >> build a bridge. when is he going to do that?

>> what puzzles me about this he knows all that lincoln history. he didn't need to go to the movie to learn that's how lincoln operates. his inability to work with democrats and republicans, listen, friends at home watching, not just republicans. democrats and republicans. you have to go back to jimmy carter to find a president viewed with as much suspicion by his own party on the hill as barack obama. >> i heard a story the other day, lamar alexander, the former governor and senator from tennessee describing a scene, howard baker and during the runup to the civil rights bill howard is sitting in dirkson's office. the phone rings. picks it up. all howard can hear is senator dirksen saying, mr. president, i

just can't come down tonight. i was there last night. i was there the night before. i have to go home. hangs up. 20 minutes pass. he hears beagles barking in the hallway and lbj walks in with his dogs. so because dirksen wouldn't come down to see him, johnson called a car got in and came up to force a conversation with dirksen. >> and lyndon johnson -- >> and we got a bill. >> lyndon johnson, and i'm not saying this president needs to be like lyndon johnson or abraham lyincoln, but he is so detached from the hill. do you need any help? what can i do? do you need me to call anybody? how can i push this along? again, we're not heaping all the blame on the president.

the counteroffer was pathetic. even the tea party groups are saying the offer was pathetic. this republican party in the house better show courage or it will be voted out of power two years from now. and i'm not talking more taxes. if you're not going to offer new revenue, you'd better offer cuts. they're doing neither. you have to blame both sides but there's only one president. >> the president will have to do something big to get this done. he has more power and sway than a lot of people, including i, thought he would have coming out of the election. he won won a mandate on these issues but he's going to have to do something big. there's been a four-year chore us of he doesn't get along with either party. i don't think there's any doubt he's going to have to find some interconnection moment that says

we're doing this. getting it through the house, whatever the terms, is going to be super hard. >> i was with a group of businessmen last night and their question was, why don't the people in washington do what we do when there's an important decision that comes up? why don't they get into a room and hammer it out, get some food, get some drinks whether it's a couple of days. one senator proposed getting them up in helicopters to camp david. when there's a looming crisis, you get in a room together. >> the president doesn't like doing that. he's not comfortable doing that and that is not the opinion of a pundit. that is a matter of record for his first four years, is it not? >> that is true. the first time it happened, it turned out very well for the country and poorly are for the president. it was the summer of 1990 where george h.w. bush went in there. we forget now how incredibly

overwhelming the deficit was. no one thought they could do anything. it's not unlike the conversations we're having now. and they went in, they did the deal, president bush had to shift from read my lips to, as only he could put it, read my hips. telephones good for the country. it cost president bush the election in 1992. that's what gave us grover norquist, et cetera. >> i'm going to lay the groundwork in terms of what we're talking about and then i do have a question. raising the eligibility age from 5 to 67 and lowering cost of living increases for social security benefits. they propose generating $800 billion in new revenue but without raising taxeses on the wealthy.

leading republicans compared their plan to one of erskine bowles. >> not even close. >> bowles reject that had connection. here is my question. there's a lot of liberals who are like, he won. and they're so arrogant about it, it's hard to like them. it's just not attractive. but he did. why can't this be about the 2% tax rate and go from there? why are we at square one and why is this on the president since he won? i understand the first four years.

at what point does he have the right to draw a line in the sand? >> he has a mandate. the 225, 230 house republicans that won their elections in their district and represent their 600,000 people and probably got a much higher percentage in their district a much, much higher percentage than the president. jon meacham, for some reason you would think this president as a state legislator would understand those dynamics. >> that's a great point. that's -- pick your percentage. a huge part of what politics -- >> 50%. >> no, not that. 47%.

if you're ever going to win a negotiation, if you're going to have a result, you have to give the other guy a way out. >> what is a way out? what is? >> raising tax rates on the extremely wealthy. >> but they have to get something else. that's the president's world view. god bless him and a lot of people believe that. i don't believe raising taxes on the wealthy will raise taxes on the super wealthy. warren buffett was here. you raise the top marginal rate, he's not going to pay any more taxes. bill gates is not going to pay any more taxes. the hedge funders are not going to pay any more taxes. rich guys in greenwich are not going to pay more taxes. they have the best accountants in the world. when i see someone, let's just raise the marginal rate five

perce percentage points i'm thinking about the owners of bagel heads in pensacola, floor are floor. they will lay off employees because their taxes will go up 5%. >> when we come back, former prime minister, tony blair, joins us on set. also, two men who have received the military's highest medal of honor, retired staff sergeant sal giunta here to tell us his remarkable story of bravery and survival in afghanistan along with retired colonel jack jacobs. first, bill karins, a little less impressive. he has the forecast, though. bill. don't even belong in the same room as those two men. good morning, everyone. i was going to start with the warmth. but let's change it up a little bit. let me show you where it is. that's not a misprint. the temperature in fair banks, alaska, right now is negative 33 degrees. last year alaska was very, very

cold. that's how this winter has started. even anchorage at is cold by your standards. the cold air is all bottled up well into canada. there's some cooler air trying to work its way down to the midwest. even this hour in the 30s is still above average for minneapolis but the warm surge, the record highs today, one more day everywhere pretty much east of the mississippi river, even new england will get into the warmer air this afternoon. some showers out there kentucky and tennessee, bring the umbrella. the storm system rolling through the west. some showers left over this morning especially into northern california from eureka to redding. this will not cause additional flooding concerns. maybe minor airport delays. that's going to end shortly. as we go to tomorrow, temperatures cool off by 10 to 15 degrees on the east coast. still pretty mild.

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look who is here, former prime minister, tony blair, now

representative to the middle east. good to have you guys, too. >> great to have you here. so baseline recognized by the u.n. what does it mean? >> the palestinians got frustrated by a lack of a process. we have to get that back to a kr credible location. >> and the obama administration is saying what the united nations did unilaterally was a setback. do you agree with that? the body i represent is split. some people are in favor of the u.s. vote. the truth of it, the only thing that will work to deliver a palestinian state side-by-side

with a secure state of israel is peace. as you can see we have a chance now. the president has been re-elected. i know he's deeply personally committed to this and we just have to regrip it, i'm afraid. >> what's gone wrong? >> it's partly because there's so much turmoil in the region right now. it's how each side views its own prospects. >> how would you characterize a credible negotiation given the fact as long as we've been alive there's been these problems that keep erupting and never, ever get solved? we've been trying for 20, 30 years. it was 50, 60 years before we got one that worked. and actually back in the year 2000, and again in 2008, you

have no option in the end. the only thing that works is to make it credible if we shape the negotiations. give it some shape so that we can see this is where it's going to go. >> dr. brzezinski says that we can never sit back and lit the israelis and palestinians do 0 this by themselves because we'll be waiting forever. >> do you agree with that assessment? >> i do. because of what's happening in egypt, and then you have syria, the region is in total turmoil. israel's two biggest allies, egypt and turkey have changed their attitude towards israel, obviously.

and for the palestinians, the gaza and west bank. it remains hugely important, this dispute, though. i can't see a peaceful region long term that's stable without the solution coming about. even with everything that makes it difficult, you've got to go back and try. >> how much of an influence/impact right now at this moment are the re-elections? >> israel is a democracy. >> yes, it makes a pig difference. what i expect to find. >> thank you for your hard work and your optimism. you've mentioned instability that runs counter to the

negotiated settlement. people are talking about jordan. if instability is an enemy of a deal, don't we have to settle for are a good, long time? >> that's possible but there is another way of looking at it which is that right now with this instability in the region this is the time to recognize to make progress and get to the politics of both sides, a situation that is hard to just imagine what's going on in the middle east and, remember, one of the things i would say to people about this egypt 50 million years ago, it's tripled its population. the average age of people in gaza is 50% under the age of 18. you have a young population all over that region. they have to have jobs. they have to have opportunity and hope for the future. it's also go the economy and,

frankly, if you could take the israeli palestinian thing to a better place. >> can you characterize a credible negotiation as it pertains to the fiscal cliff? what would it take? >> i'm an outsider. everyone is going to beat up on everyone hard. the country will expect the deal to be done and so there will have to be a bit of give and take. it's miles apart. and on the outside we need you to sort this. if you get this resolved, i

think you'll move forward strongly. when we look our situation in europe, it's troubling. i think it will trigger a strong growth pattern for you. so let's go back to finding peace. i know there's a question you've been asked many times and you thought about how do we replicate where in the 1980s you had a situation so bad. you had the i.r.a. trying to kill the prime minister. you had jerry adams talking about peace. people would no more believe they would shake hands than believe the leader of hamas would go hug netanyahu.

how did it happen there? what did you learn through that process? you had such a huge role. >> first that you've got to get it in shape. you have to work out where a potential area of agreement is and then you let that start to shape the negotiations. the second thing very important is you have to calm the violence. you can never negotiate if there's active violence going on. you just don't give up because you can't. once we even got the good friday agreement, we spent ten years implementing.

you focus and focus down on it. >> it seems to me there's not going to be -- listen, you look at my votes in congress. you should have the key to tel aviv on my wall in my office. we're not going to have peace without hamas at the table. you may not be able to say this. as a strong supporter of israel i know if hamas is not there, then you're going to have them killing whoever makes the deal. how to move them it from where they are to the i.r.a.? >> we managed to get an agreement. >> in order to get people in the door, the violence had to stop. so in my view, if you were able to do that and they were prepared to be part of a

two-state solution. it's very hard to say to the israelis negotiate with them in circumstances where they're firing rockets. >> you're still saying you don't have a right to exist. >> yeah. would it be better if you had hamas at the table? yes. totally unrealistic. >> what do they want? what does hamas want? >> to be frank, you can't be sure. >> it's probably part nationalist. what the agenda is can be hard to decipher. the basic fact is if you want to get people around the table there's got to be at least an agreement with the violence sto stops.

jerry murphy lived in an area where it jumped 90%. to go to the table you instinctively that northern ireland, they did not need any more martyrs. it was very effective. >> by the way, we could do this. it was moving ahead. if we managed to get gaza opening up, stop the weapons coming into gaza, open up gaza, you have, for example, we're trying to develop the moment you have a gas field about 50 kilometers off the coast of gaza that would make them energy independent and would give them revenue for their authority. the thing i find most frustrating, it is possible to see it. >> prime minister tony blair,

thank you very much. it's good to have you back on the show. >> thank you. >> all the best to your wife. when we come back there are 80 living recipients of the mi military's highest decoration, the medal of honor. two of those men join us next. form former staff sergeant sal giunta and retired colonel jack jacobs. [ male announcer ] when a major hospital wanted to provide better employee benefits while balancing the company's bottom line, their very first word was... [ to the tune of "lullaby and good night" ] ♪ af-lac ♪ aflac [ male announcer ] find out more at... [ duck ] aflac! [ male announcer ] ...forbusiness.com. [ yawning sound ] ok! it's a new way to get cash back deals and it's called bankamerideals. i sign in to my online banking... click the "cash back deals" tab... and pick the deals i want.

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today marks the first time in nearly 40 years that the recipient of the medal of honor for an ongoing conflict has been able to come to the white house and accept this recognition in person. it is my privilege to present our nation's highest decoration, the medal of honor. as humble as he is heroic, staff sergeant salvatore giunta. i'm going to go off script and say i really like this guy.

>> the first to be awarded since the veietnam war. he's now out with a new book living with honor. also joining us, msnbc analyst and medal of honor recipient jack jacobs. sal, you were stationed in an area known as the valley of death. tell us about what it is like living with honor? >> originally when i joined the military, you don't ever expect to have any recognition. you want to better the people around you and we all are products of our environment. the amount of contact we were taking, the amount of fire fights, rpgs, rockets, whatever

it may be. that tour for us was a 15-month tour, which was it shall that's pretty long for some young people. we are there to help them out, find ways of doing the same thing they've been doing. when i wrote the book i want ed to describe the valley and the people around me. so often i'm congratulated or patted on the back and thanked and i've never done anything in the military alone. i was able to put my buddies' names in print and highlight the actionses they've done. there are so many things that we don't hear about. >> our good friend sebastien younger who talked about stalked about your heroism, your unit, and the terrible conditions.

i remember reading about it. it seemed remarkable what you did. what you did and how you describe it like so many other recipients that said in the past, i did my job. it was reflex. i was trained well and i was going to save my buddies. talk about that night. and also the reluctance to be called a hero. i've never met a hero who isn't reluctant to be called a hero. >> well, this is what we expect. it's about the team. you don't have to worry about yourself. we have to take care of each

other. we're all in this together. it is one team and one fight. that night it was just that, brothers looking out for brothers. in no way, shape, or form, if this is a painting, my brush stroke isn't the first or the last one and it isn't the most beautiful or amazing. it's one more brush stroke in time that helped paint this picture of this moment in afghanistan. the men around me fired so many more shots. those are the guys, i'm here today. two of my buddies died that day and they weren't looking for for themselv themselves. he didn't want to be called a hero for what he considered failing.

what the sergeant remembers are not who he saved but who was lost. you felt the same way? >> i did. and sal and i were talking about this. when i was decorated there were 400 living recipients. there was still a living recipient from the box of rebellion alive, beijing 1900. quite a few world war i recipients. we had the same experience. nobody wants to be called a hero. you think about all the people who perform valiantly. we've had tens of millions of americans in uniform. so many of them perform valiantly and maybe nobody saw it.

it was lost accidentally or on purpose. you don't wear it for yourself. you wear it for those who care. >> they say they're not heroes. the heroes are the ones that department come home. >> that's true. very true. how difficult was it or is it for you to adjust to being a medal of honor recipient and that makes you in the eyes of people in your hometown makes you different when you're not different other than having a medal? >> it's strange because it all happened overnight. to be awarded the medal of honor, nothing but average my entire life. i pride myself. i can say i'm average.

i owe is to the people who didn't come back who can't tell their story. being a medal of honor recipient like jack we represent the best, the brightest, the strongest, the bravest, most courageous, the most selfless people in the united states of america. for people to look at my face, i can do it or i should do it and owe it to my brothers to do it makes me you be easy with the whole situation. >> there's a recipient in the second world war who said this medal is not mine. it belongs to all of my fellow marines who didn't it make it back. he said it is not mine. i keep it in trust. think about the long tours. how is your wife, jen?

you have a little girl. >> i do. lily. she is 14 months. she is awesome. >> 14 months. that's amazing. looking at pictures of you and your wife i guess before you went off to battle. >> my wife is such a strong, amazing woman. without her being my constant support, when i need to start whining she says keep it there, keep it on track. i can't handle. i couldn't handle being a military spouse. i don't believe i could. i'm fortunate to have such support at home. >> could you speak to that extended remarks, if if you

will? the impact -- >> you say it's too difficult. >> the amount of time, you leave for combat, but there was training before that and the training happens in the woods. it happens in the swamps. it happens in the jungles. that's all time away from home. the parents and for me at 21 years old, for the second time, i watched buddies turn 19 and 20 without leaving the country. it could get you two birthdays defend i defending on when you get deployed. we were stationed in italy to families and seeing their

children who weren't born yet are walking and talking. it's the family that really is the glue that holds it together. they are one of their parents and it's not that they don't want to be there, their business takes them elsewhere. >> throws everything off. here is to jen. thank you so much. congratulations on the book. >> thank you so much. >> colonel jack jacobs, thank you as well. >> it's good to be here. it's a must read and we look forward to getting up to west point. >> soon. we'll do it. >> all the best to you. new jersey governor chris christie heads to washington to ask for billions in aid as the economic toel reaches $40 billion in his state. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 let's talk about low-cost investing.

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down to the final seconds before they came on stage and watch when they come on stage. the epic spaz out meltdown. what is that? i don't get it. >> the question is, mark halperin, asking about the beatles, is one direction really as big as the bay city rollers? >> probably not. >> i don't think so. who debuted on howard cosell are from saturday night. >> that was a good show. i learned mika protestses too much. she wants to be a roadie or a groupie for one direction. >> i learned that any day where we have staff sergeant sal giunta to talk is great. >> we're raised up. >> and i'll reiterate